While reading the book The Spirit of Truth by Arthur Katz and Paul Volk, I became aware that there was one paragraph I wanted to read several times. Here it is. “The world is full of people with keen discernment, scrutinizing the church. Our profession of truth has drawn all the more attention to ourselves. People in the world have learned to recognize pretense. They are well schooled in the art of bluffing. They know all about convenience, expediency, insincerity, and manipulation. They can sense superficial relationships. If they find in the church nothing essentially different from what is found outside of it; if they see no real difference in the way money and power are handled, then no amount of words, no matter how true they may be in themselves, is ever going to impress them.”
I found myself taking note of the very embarrassing and incriminating phrase, “nothing essentially different.” It follows then, if the church is, by popular perception, almost no different from the world, what need is there in having another place or institution just like the secular? If there is to be a distinction between the world and the church, what is that supposed to look like? Surely it has to be deeper than appearances. For there to be a marked difference, beliefs and subsequent behaviors must be different as well. I recall the words from the scriptures, “Be IN the world, but not OF the world.” So what is of the world that the believer should not be “in.” INvolved with, INtegrated into, INculcated by, INdoctrinated by, INstructed towards, etc. Another scripture comes to mind.
“There is a way that seems right to man, but the end of that way is death.” So doing what seems to be right or living what seems to be the right way, may not be right at all. In fact, what seems right, may be seriously wrong. The only way we can live a “righteous” life is to be doing the right things that are not necessarily formulated from our own perceptions of right and wrong. This is where the authority of the scriptures becomes essential to our day-to-day lives. A short version of this reality might be, “If the scripture says to do something or behave in a certain way, we should do it.” It is the right thing to do. Contrariwise, if we are instructed by the Bible to not do something, it is in our best interest to refrain from doing it.
The Ten Commandments come to mind for most believers that are instructed in the “Thou shalts” and Thou shalt nots.” But, there is a whole lot more to living than these allowances and prohibitions. To name just a few, there are relationships, personal preferences, and moral issues that play into our lives continually. What positions should the Christian believers take when the church leadership or members adopt and practice some of the secular world’s perspectives on morals, relationships, and preferences that are contrary to the scriptures?
This is our first blog. If you would like to weigh in with your own thoughts, please comment. For this blog, ask yourself what is the biblical response to a congregation that is “looking the other way” when recognizing a compromise in their midst. Consider and comment on how leadership might address these issues. Or what other means we may have as a church to confront compromise in general. I am looking forward to hearing from each of you. Lot vexed his righteous soul daily with his city’s unrighteous deeds. I hope you don’t find this first blog to be too vexing.
The believer and his stance in society….
I see four different approaches to Church and popular culture in the scripture: penetrate, isolate, insulate, and evacuate. Most Christians are in abdicate mode!
We are told to be “salt” (flavor and preservation) and “light” (revelation and penetration) so whenever possible we penetrate the culture with an attitude of “Thy Kingdom come, Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven.” Each of us are incarnations of God’s Spirit and we bring a sanctifying presence and transforming power to those around us.
However, there are times when we need to isolate: The concept of a retreat or fast is a scriptural model. Moses was 40 years in the wilderness, Jesus 40 days, David fled from the presence of Saul and lived in caves, Elijah was on the run from Ahab & Jezebel while they were killing off the prophets of God, John, the baptizer, hung out in the wilderness eating locust and wild honey, Paul, the apostle, spent 4 years in the Arabian desert., So times of seeking the Lord and in the face of persecution would be primary examples of the need to come apart.
When we send our children into society we do the best to insulate them by “training them up in the way they should go,” that way they influence rather than being seduced. A submarine is able to plumb the depths of the ocean because the pressure from the inside is adequate to keep the pressure from the outside from imploding it. By filling ourselves with the word of God singing and praying we get filled with the Spirit creating a counter culture to the corrupt culture around us. In this way we “save ourselves from this corrupt generation” Acts 2:40.
Finally, there may come a point where we need to flee (evacuate) as in the words of scripture, “Come out from among them and be separate lest you become a partaker in their plagues” Revelation 18:4. Lot and his family would be a good example of this, Noah preparing an ark is another. Jesus said in Luke 21:20, “When you see Jerusalem surrounded by armies…flee.”
I believe we are in a time of penetration, participation and explanation. We may have lost the culture war (as some say) with the institution of abortion and homosexual marriage, but we are still in a position of influence and opportunity. So I say, let’s pray and obey with the hope that they will repent and God will relent as He did under the preaching of Jonah. A “greater than Jonah is here”! The body of Christ.
David, the core phrase, “To speak the truth in love” means that we say things the way they truly are. “The truth hurts” and “This is for your own good,” are other ways of saying the discipline of the Lord is not pleasant, but afterward it yields the peaceable fruit of righteousness. Our present culture lives and acts like “judgment” is a dirty word. In fact, our culture does not judge a sinful act because it is not a very kind thing to do to someone. Well, that may be true, but to not judge may actually yield more dire consequences than just wounding someone’s feelings. Now we are tempted to justify our decision to speak up or out as being the lesser of two evils, but that is not the basis for any decision whatsoever. We judge, not because it is a lesser or greater degree of evil, but because it is evil and the right thing to do if the Word of God has already judged it so. Bringing it back to our culture, because we do not judge correctly and as often as needed, we are moving towards what the scripture calls “lawlessness.” Once again, every man will do what is right in their own eyes and bring on the same wrath that Noah’s generation experienced. We will be judged because we are not judging ourselves. To put it in a nicer light, we are not living by good judgment.
In order to settle the judgment issue/question, just become a fruit inspector, an “occupation” which the NT allows for sure. “By their fruits you shall know them.” Matt. 7:16. So, if one is uncomfortable with judging, then let them become a Fruit Inspector. That has been authorized by no less than our Lord.
Don, is there a subtle difference between “Good works” and “The Fruits of the Spirit?” I ask because the scripture talks about even the unsaved, (wicked) performing good works to/for/with one another. Luke 6 (KJV Strong’s) 32 For if ye love them which love you, what thank have ye? for sinners also love those that love them. 33 And if ye do good to them which do good to you, what thank have ye? for sinners also do even the same. 34 And if ye lend to them of whom ye hope to receive, what thank have ye? for sinners also lend to sinners, to receive as much again. Evidently, it is not enough just to look at works to determine the salvation status of people. So, can you provide a fuller understanding of what fruit is vs. apparent good works?
Douglas, on your response to my comment on being a “Fruit Inspector.” Motivation becomes critical in knowing the difference between “Good Works,” on the one hand, and “Fruit of the Spirit,” on the other. Anyone is capable of doing good works. Ostensibly our country (or any decent society) is/was founded on, among other biblical principles, the idea of “Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.” But what is our motivation as followers of Jesus Christ? St. Paul is instructive in Col. 3:17, “And whatever you do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God and the Father by Him.” We (hopefully) know to whom the credit belongs and we acknowledge and thank Him for it. The world is capable of “good works,” but they will either take the credit for themselves or at a minimum, not give God the credit. Sadly, many Christians fall into the same trap.
Now to the Fruit of the Spirit: First, you will note that “good works” is plural, but “Fruit of the Spirit” is singular. there is but one fruit of the Spirit and that is LOVE. All the others mentioned flow from that one supreme fruit. Thus, all “good works” done in LOVE are Fruits of the Spirit. They flow directly from LOVE. When done out of any other motivation, they are “good works” done for many reasons (often nefarious) and unto many other gods. Good works done out of the wrong motivation, can, and often time do, fail; But, LOVE never fails, I Corinth. 13:8b. Thus, just to be systematic in our theology, any good work done out of LOVE becomes a fruit of the Spirit and will always accomplish that for which our Lord sends it, even when we often don’t get to see those results. Or, perhaps are too blind to see them! Thanks for making me reflect on the subject.
Don, that was beautifully stated. The “Fruit” being singular and all in love. The fact that there are multiple reasons people do good things is something to ponder indeed. From outside in, a charitable act can look like a very generous gift, while the real motivation may be a tax right-off with a selfish motivation at the heart of the matter. Lord, Lord, did we not give to the poor? We’ll sure you did, but you did it to be seen of men and get a handy right-off to boot. That is not love by any stretch of the imagination or wallet thereof. Thanks Don for the understanding.
When I consider the word ‘isolate’ within the context of this discussion, I think of ‘reflection’.
Deeply ingrained patterns of striving so hard to accomplish the will of God within my life has left me hard, like beaten paths worn paths in my heart through excessive travel (concept from Fruit of the Spirit by Phillip Keller).
As I have reflected and seen that I was battling everyone around me, and repelling them because of my strict allegiance to biblical truth, I couldn’t help but finally notice that everyone else around me was ‘gone’. I believe the Lord showed me that this was ‘striving’. To be zealously working so hard at serving Christ, my time with Him was what I sacrificed. This caused the sweet fragrance of my anointing to lose its freshness and eventually just become a stench to those around me. If we think about drawing others to Christ, I certainly was not. The Lord reminded me that Mary CHOSE the better way of sitting at His feet. Paul in His zeal was kicking at the goads and working against Christ.
This hardness of my heart occurred over long periods of time, eroding bit by bit at my relationship with Him. While I am aware that the mind and heart are often synonymous in the Bible, my mind does not cry. My mind only thinks. The thought came to my mind this morning, “When was the last time I wept over lost sinners in prayer?” Years ago, this was a large part of who I was. Now the only time I can remember doing that was – way back then.
Yes, I agree that tolerance is not acceptable, and speaking the truth in ‘love’, is what is needed for me at this time. How MANY times have I heard, “It’s not WHAT you say, it’s HOW you are saying it.” When I consider the grace of God in my life and how He has (and continues) to stand by me, He is truly longsuffering. When I consider this, I realize that I really have so little to offer anyone other than the grace of God and love that He has shown me. Men are quick to put other men on a pedestal because of their great thinking, problem solving abilities, and the like. Such as in my case. If all of this is not dropped at the Lord’s feet, they are seeds for pride.
All of these ingrained habits, developed year over year, take time to ‘undo’. What is much needed in my life at this time is TRANSFORMATION, as Paul says, “Be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind.” I have to intentionally ‘submit’ my mind to Christ these days, or I become a clanging symbol or a noisy gong, without showing any love whatsoever. The kids around me don’t care much about how much I know. They just want a smile, and yet Jesus says, “Suffer not the little Ones to come unto me, for such is the Kingdom of Heaven.” My dad’s dog doesn’t care how much I know, and yet Proverbs says that the righteous man has regard for his beast, and the Lord put us in dominion over all things. The dog just wants a pat on the back and for me to throw his ball. So how much love am I showing either the children or dog if I just work all of the time, or sit at my computer? None, I’d say. And eventually, if you don’t show someone (or something) love, it will leave, and then you will have no opportunity at all to lead them to Christ – or better yet, just to let them know how much Christ loves them.
These few examples, and so many more within me, scream at me for time alone with God. When I am with men, they continually put me on a pedestal to solve problems and I am at the point where I just want to get away from everyone, and mostly myself. The only place that I can do that is at the feet of the Savior. When life becomes a toil for me, and I see that my life and days have become a labor for me and I am no longer in ‘the rest’ of God, then it is time for me to insulate. How quickly I fall back into my old habits! If I am reverting to my old ways very quickly, then those new thoughts and behaviors have not had time to take and develop deep roots within me and I need to insulate in order for them to do so, less the little sprouts be uprooted.
When I hear my thoughts say, that I really don’t like people very much anymore, it is a flag. It has nothing to do with them, but everything to do with me, and I need to insulate. When I can’t think about a person’s situation without being moved to compassion or tears, then there’s something very different about me than when I was first filled with the Spirit of God, and I need to isolate. If isolating doesn’t solve it, then I need to insulate, because as James says, “these things not ought to be.” Fresh water and dirty water can’t come out of the same well.
Many times for me, winning the battle is keeping my mouth shut, which means ruling over my flesh, and all of that is harder for me these days than it used to be. When it is, it shows that my flesh is in charge, and not Christ. I haven’t ‘logically’ won many to Christ lately, and that is probably because they are not being shown the love that He has for them through me.
I understand the need to rightly diving the truth, and to have correct doctrine. I think that discernment is crucial. I also know that scripture teaches that (even for Christians) what can be a sin to one is not a sin to another who does the same thing in faith. Therefore, sensitivity to the Holy Spirit is paramount. To speak the truth in love, to show love, to demonstrate Christ’s love. To do everything in Christ’s love, to the glory of God.
David
Yes. I think you nailed it with the word “retreat.” The church does need that. Leaders need that because the rest and recuperation is so necessary before going back into the thick of the battle. Sometime a retreat is the most strategic thing you can do in a battle, regroup, replenish, refresh, and re-engage. Thanks Greg. This is a perfect example of the need for isolation. I like the idea of isolation when used as a chemical or troubleshooting technique where one “isolates” the problem to examine it more thoroughly without the influence of other chemicals, electronic components, or system-level complications, that make it difficult to attribute the problem to just one cause. In terms of retreating from the ways of the world, I think if we isolate, give ourselves entirely to prayer, the Word, and fasting, we might receive the singular revelation from God that resolves our concerns of any nature which impede our relationships or progress on behalf of the church. If we carry the thought of isolation and troubleshooting forward, we can see that a retreat may help us resolve the issues of “mixture” with the culture that might be at the core of the problems with which we deal.
I think the concept of retreat or fast is the scriptural model. Moses was 40 years in the wilderness, Jesus 40 days, David fled from the presence of Saul and lived in caves, Elijah was on the run from Ahab & Jezebel while they were killing off the prophets of God, Paul, the aposle, spent 4 years in the Arabian desert and John, the baptizer, hung out in the wilderness, So times of seeking the Lord and in times of persecution would be primary examples.
Greg,
I really enjoy and appreciate your succinct, yet thorough comment. I thought, as being a church, about the word, “Isolate.” I asked myself, when would or should the church isolate itself and to what end? Can you or others on this blog thread help me understand when isolation from the “world” might be appropriate? I understand the enjoining words, “ Be in the world but not of the world.” But that doesn’t necessarily imply isolation as much as it connotes a separateness or distinctiveness from the world witnessed by our visible character, choices, and actions. Thanks
I see four different approaches to Church and popular culture in the scripture: Isolate, insulate, penetrate and evacuate. Like our study in Relational Forgiveness (Luke 17:3) our approach has to be mitigated by the other’s willingness to receive. We are told to be “salt” (preservation) and “light” (revelation and penetration) so whenever possible we penetrate the culture with an attitude of “Thy Kingdom come, Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven.” However, there are times when we need to isolate, Paul retreated to the desert for four years living as a monk and hermit, John, the baptizer, was “a voice crying in the wilderness…. eating locust and wild honey.” When we send our children into society we do the best to insulate them by “training them up in the way they should go.” That way they influence without being seduced. Finally, there may come a point where we need to flee (evacuate) as in the words of scripture, “Come out from among them and be separate lest you become a partaker in their plagues.” Lot and his family would be a good example of this. I believe we are in a time of penetration, participation and explanation. We may have lost the culture war as some say but we are still in a position of influence and opportunity. So I say let’s pray and obey with the hope that they will repent and God will relent.
Thank you again Rense for your thoughtful comment. I would hope that no church anywhere thinks they have The Corner on The Truth. I think we are called to be stewards of truth and the Holy Spirit of Truth is both the author and administrator of The Truth. Jesus Himself being The Truth, The Life, and The Way. Every body of believers must work for unity within based upon the effectual working of every part until we all come to the full measure of a man in Christ…who is the embodiment of Truth. In so becoming, we need to speak the truth, (tell the truth), and live in truth. What God calls a lie, we must therefore call a lie, lest we find ourselves opposing the truth. Any distortion of the truth must therefore be a lie as well. So, we must watch for distortions. The most troublesome character of deceit or being deceived is that if one or a group is truly deceived, He, she, or they will not be able to discern if they are deceived. Hence, we stay fixed to the Word of God and the Holy Spirit who leads us into all Truth. The ancient philosophers asked, “What is Truth?” I believe Pilate asked the same question. The trouble for him was that he found no fault, (he discovered the truth), but still acted falsely to please the crowd. It is therefore possible in pleasing the crowd, building a congregation, or a society, the truth can be modified or set aside to gain membership or curry favor. Many politicians have made this practice a credo. In the last days, preachers will gather to themselves those who have itchy ears. We might refer to these as religious politicians. That means the preachers and teachers will say what their hearers “want” to hear and not what they ‘need” to hear. If Jesus said that will be a sign for the last days, shouldn’t we also be watchful of those pernicious teachers creeping in among us?” There is no need for us to take a defensive position of or for any congregation that is preaching the Truth, The Whole Truth, and nothing but the Truth, so help us God! Let’s keep watching and praying together as we have been admonished to do so. Thanks again for your comment.
As I was waking up this morning this scripture popped into my head and I thought how hard it must have been for Paul to explain and teach that our relationship with Jesus and our brethren is more important than following religious tradition. And of course I don’t mean to neglect the process of sanctification by His blood. I tend to like nice and orderly boundaries but it seems like people have different degrees of faith and the key part of this scripture is to not offend. I believe our motivation for our actions is what God is after. Even though I am submitted to a church in Fort Bragg I attend 4 other churches out of the area. My musical calling has opened doors so I have the opportunity to see different denominations and organizations in a Sunday setting. Every church believes that they have the best teaching and scriptural foundation. Every church believes they have interpreted the scriptures more accurately than the other churches and denominations. This lesson of Paul’s talks about knowledge puffing us up. I think being watchful is good as long as you let love be the goal. It is always easier to see the speck than deal with the log.
1 Corinthians 8 New International Version (NIV)
Concerning Food Sacrificed to Idols 8 Now about food sacrificed to idols: We know that “We all possess knowledge.” But knowledge puffs up while love builds up. 2 Those who think they know something do not yet know as they ought to know. 3 But whoever loves God is known by God.
This blog is not concerned with any particular area or region. Judgment and discernment go hand in hand and we need to remember it was Peter who said “For the time is come that judgment must begin AT the house of God: and if it first begins at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the Gospel of God?” That word “AT” in Greek means “A separation of a part from the whole or of any kind of separation of one thing from another by which the union or fellowship of the two is destroyed.” To me this is like the separation of the sheep from the goats or the wheat from the tares. The curious thing about the tares is that they are planted by our enemy and grow up and with the wheat for all practical purposes. A picture of wolves in sheep’s clothing for disguising the predator of innocent lambs. The sad fact is that not everyone that claims to be a Christian or attends a Christian assembly is in fact a Christian. Right up to the last minute they will be crying “Lord Lord” and Christ will say “I never knew you.” Is it possible that they themselves thought because they were doing “Christian” things, they actually believed they too were Christians? I think these souls may be surprised when Jesus says, “depart from me ye workers of iniquity.” How is it possible to be doing “Christian” works on one hand, and on the other be called workers of iniquity? Apparently it is. Our standard for judgment and discernment must be The Word of God, its prohibitions and its admonitions may not please the carnal mind, but we have a call to holiness that mandates obedience to EVERY word out of our Father’s mouth. If judgment is too harsh a word for the kind of examination we should make of ourselves, perhaps the word “Discern” might be evoked in its place. We must be watchful for the wolves and discern if they are disguised as sheep. Listen to the words of their mouths and see if they bring with them pernicious doctrines, subverting the Word of God for personal gain or pleasure. Let’s at least be watchful, especially if we are called to love and serve one another in the Holy Spirit who is also called The Spirit of Truth.
I can see you have all studied the scripture and desired to follow after the teachings of Christ. After 45 years of engaging in ministry and raising a family I am always amazed at how very diligent and loving men go astray and even divide a church and cause division in the Body of Christ. It would appear to me that our theology can be can be sound but if there is even one little bit of pride it is like Jesus said it will breed hypocrisy. There is an authority that can keep this in check. If there is anything that destroys the safety in our midst it is the burning of bridges and leaving churches and spreading gossip about each other. If you look back on the time of your conversion you will see God placing key people in your lives as counselors and teachers. In 1 Cor 3 and 4 I believe Paul is addressing this judging and competing spirit. As we press on in our gifts and calling we need to report back to those that; “have begotten us” (1 Cor. 4:15). My advice is to be careful about judging the Body of Christ in a geographical area until you really get to know it personally and have taken the time to meet one on one.
Truly Brian, we all fall short of the full measure of a man in Christ. I am moved to gratitude for the mercy of God where all that we lack is addressed by the mercies that are new every morning. The scripture that reminds us judgment begins AT the house of God is a sobering reminder that sound, biblical judgment must be IN the house of God first. That’s a whole new blog in itself. What is the nature and direction of that judgment? What are the principles and guidelines for that judgment? What is it supposed to yield?
Yes, Douglas, vexed by my own flesh – daily – Praying the Lord to complete the work that He has started in each of us:
Romans 7:24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
Romans 8:26 Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.
Thanks be to God!
1 Peter 3:15 But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear
https://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/dietrich_bonhoeffer_388924
We must learn to regard people less in light of what they do or omit to do, and more in the light of what they suffer. Dietrich Bonhoeffer
Matthew 12:20 A bruised reed shall he not break, and smoking flax shall he not quench, till he send forth judgment unto victory.
Matthew 12:21 And in his name shall the Gentiles trust.
Matthew 19:23 Then said Jesus unto his disciples, Verily I say unto you, That a rich man shall hardly enter into the kingdom of heaven.
Matthew 19:24 And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.
Matthew 19:25 When his disciples heard it, they were exceedingly amazed, saying, Who then can be saved?
Matthew 19:26 But Jesus beheld them, and said unto them, With men this is impossible; but with God all things are possible.
Jude 1:20 But ye, beloved, building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost,
Jude 1:21 Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life.
Jude 1:22 And of some have compassion, making a difference:
Jude 1:23 And others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire; hating even the garment spotted by the flesh.
2 Timothy 3:1 This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come.
2 Timothy 3:2 For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,
2 Timothy 3:3 Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good,
2 Timothy 3:4 Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
2 Timothy 3:5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.
2 Timothy 3:6 For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts,
2 Timothy 3:7 Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.
2 Timothy 3:8 Now as Jannes and Jambres withstood Moses, so do these also resist the truth: men of corrupt minds, reprobate concerning the faith.
2 Timothy 3:9 But they shall proceed no further: for their folly shall be manifest unto all men, as theirs also was.
2 Timothy 3:10 But thou hast fully known my doctrine, manner of life, purpose, faith, longsuffering, charity, patience,
2 Timothy 3:11 Persecutions, afflictions, which came unto me at Antioch, at Iconium, at Lystra; what persecutions I endured: but out of them all the Lord delivered me.
2 Timothy 3:12 Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution.
2 Timothy 3:13 But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived.
2 Timothy 3:14 But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them;
2 Timothy 3:15 And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.
2 Timothy 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
2 Timothy 3:17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.
2 Timothy 4:1 I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom;
2 Timothy 4:2 Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.
2 Timothy 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;
2 Timothy 4:4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.
Isaiah 5:20 Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!
Isaiah 5:21 Woe unto them that are wise in their own eyes, and prudent in their own sight!
Isaiah 5:22 Woe unto them that are mighty to drink wine, and men of strength to mingle strong drink:
Isaiah 5:23 Which justify the wicked for reward, and take away the righteousness of the righteous from him!
Isaiah 5:24 Therefore as the fire devoureth the stubble, and the flame consumeth the chaff, so their root shall be as rottenness, and their blossom shall go up as dust: because they have cast away the law of the LORD of hosts, and despised the word of the Holy One of Israel.
Matthew 24:4 And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you.
Matthew 24:5 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.
Matthew 24:6 And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.
Matthew 24:7 For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.
Matthew 24:8 All these are the beginning of sorrows.
Matthew 24:9 Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name’s sake.
Matthew 24:10 And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another.
Matthew 24:11 And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.
Matthew 24:12 And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold.
Matthew 24:13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
Luke 3:9 And now also the axe is laid unto the root of the trees: every tree therefore which bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
James 5:19 Brethren, if any of you do err from the truth, and one convert him;
James 5:20 Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins.
John 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
John 1:15 John bare witness of him, and cried, saying, This was he of whom I spake, He that cometh after me is preferred before me: for he was before me.
John 1:16 And of his fulness have all we received, and grace for grace.
John 1:17 For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.
After reading and contemplating on all the excellent and thoughtful content that has been shared there really isn’t anything I can add other than the Scriptures that came to mind as a result of what was presented on this topic.
Seems to me we need as much grace and truth as these tabernacles of flesh can hold to complete the work the Lord has for each of us. May we all continue to grow in the grace and truth of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ and apprehend all that we have been apprehended for…
God Bless and keep you all in these perilous times…
Repentance, Reconciliation, Restoration – Ambassador’s for Christ will do well to represent, communicate and DEMONSTRATE these three attributes within the Body of Christ by the power of the Holy Spirit, because…
1 Peter 4:17 For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?
Spot on concerning salvation by faith alone. And as per “wolves in sheep’s,” clothing, Jesus harshest criticism in the NT is not for Rome, or for prostitutes, or foreigners in the land or for women and children; or for even thieves on a cross. No his harshest criticism was always for the religious leaders of His day. See any hints of that litany of concerns in our day????
Best to remember that the number one characteristic of the Christian is LOVE (God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, God is Love; thus, God so loved the world that he came Himself!. Look for that in in politics, government, ecumenical situations, and denominationalism, among many and sundry other areas. Love never fails. Hate always fails! Every word of scripture must be filtered through the lens of love. Then, it won’t be business as usual. Love will transform people and the world…if we are ever to be transformed.
Rense, you have really targeted and identified the issue at its core. When you said the critical factor was the question, “Who do we belong to?” After Jesus declares that many will come boasting that they fed the poor, cast out devils, healed the sick, etc. in His name, He, Jesus says “depart from me ye workers of iniquity…I never knew you.” That scripture haunts me in a way that shouts, not whispers, that I am saved by faith in him and not by works or good deeds that I can and should do.” How many there are that claim they are Christian because they “behave” like a “good” Christian. Taken to its logical conclusion, many say they really don’t need God because they ARE a good person. These are the hardest type of people to win to Christ. Jesus said the prostitutes and tax collectors will come into the Kingdom, yet the overtly, publicly religious will not come in because they think they have no need of salvation via a bloody, bruised, Savior. Put another way, Jesus says only the sick call for the physician. No amount of Christian-like dress-up will disguise the fact that underneath these “holy” self-righteous, garments, we are naked, destitute, and in desperate need of the totally unself-righteousness of the Son of God dying on the cross, crucifying the self-righteous flesh, in order to enter into the Kingdom of Heaven. Therefore we cannot automatically claim salvation status for either an individual or a congregation based on good works alone. Can two walk together unless they agree? Maybe for awhile, but there is a point of mutual departure along the path when critical concerns don’t line up and personal integrity says, I can no longer share this or that view and I see we are heading in different directions if we are both wanting to reach the goals of our individual convictions. The critical truth is that man does not define the goal at the end of the path, and therefore the path must diverge when there are multiple goals. Predestination for me is simply a statement that their is one acceptable goal established by God and one path to that goal. One Way, leads to that goal. As long as we stay on that path, we are pre-destined to arrive at the goal provided we keep moving forward. I think it is very important to realize that we do not determine ourselves “who we belong to.” But God Himself determines who belongs to Him. We do not and did not choose Him, but He chose us before the foundation of the world. Therefore we cannot claim we are saved by good works because those good works came after we were saved. He knew us while we were in our mother’s womb…before we knew him. These are mysteries indeed, and the very stuff of our salvation. Let’s be sure not to confuse acts of man, ( good works) with the Act of God, (Salvation by Grace through Faith and not of works) as a means of total justification and our present and eventual passage into the Kingdom of Heaven. Though our salvation is evidenced by good works, good works are not the means of our salvation. Good works may in fact be a cover-up in the name of goodness that allows many other transgressions to co-exist without good judgment, all in the name of love, tolerance, and acceptance. Our hearts want to vote for all three, but the Word of God tells us some things are simply not tolerated or acceptable to God. Those are the things that make us like the world and not distinct from it as Pastor Glen Coulter mentions in the previous comment.
Douglass,
thanks for doing this blog. It is always good to communicate the Word of God. It seems like we all struggle with how to reach out to the community and really show God’s love. For me the showing of love and patience to other Christians is one very good way to be a witness. John 13:35 New International Version (NIV)
35 By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another.”
Being different than the world comes from the power of His blood. He wants us to love those around us. Who do we belong to is the question.?
Paul’s Use of His Freedom:
19 Though I am free and belong to no one, I have made myself a slave to everyone, to win as many as possible. 20 To the Jews I became like a Jew, to win the Jews. To those under the law I became like one under the law (though I myself am not under the law), so as to win those under the law. 21 To those not having the law I became like one not having the law (though I am not free from God’s law but am under Christ’s law), so as to win those not having the law. 22 To the weak I became weak, to win the weak. I have become all things to all people so that by all possible means I might save some. 23 I do all this for the sake of the gospel, that I may share in its blessings.
Hopefully some of this is in context to the other posts but I am just giving my thoughts.
Of course it is good to test the spirits. 1 John 4 English Standard Version (ESV)
Test the Spirits
1 John 4 English Standard Version (ESV)
Test the Spirits
4 Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world. 2 By this you know the Spirit of God: every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God,
Some times we just have to trust other Christians when they say that Jesus is their Lord and savior.
love to you guys, Rense
Wow what a great subject! If we only realize how important it is to find our place in the church, live distinctly apart from The ungodly ways of the world, and also realize that as we do this,it will make the local church virtually immune to self-destructive compromises. Numbers in the church or the size of the church just don’t matter. As we continue to renew our minds, so shall our hearts be filled with his glory, remembering we are his tabernacle to be filled daily with his presence and sharing in that glory as we keep our hearts and minds fixed on the Third Heaven, the place of his dwelling. Glen Coulter – Pastor, The Father’s House, Palo Alto, California.
Greg, there was so much value in your comment that I read it twice. I was particularly struck with the following statement: “The point is, he didn’t polarize the conversation with initial statements debating truth claims, but first gained the right to be heard by deftly inserting himself into an ongoing conversation, and then offered increasingly effective information substantiating his rhetoric regarding the truth about a God unknown to the philosophers. His methodology, demeanor, and delivery were collectively effective enough to gain hiim another hearing. “Hey come back again and tell us more!” He did all of this in the center of their culture.”
Would to God that our approach in and to all potentially conflict-engendering disscussions could begin with this mindful, considerate, and engaging methodology. I sincerely hope that for Christians mindfully representing the character and nature of Christ in all of our conversations, we would dispense with personal social or political opinion and focus on the end goal of the verbal exchange, to be able to find that opening, “deftly insert, and present the Bible-based truth, “increasingly effective information,” that will persuade or convince our hearers. I completely agree that we do not begin by presenting our pedantic version of the truth, but trust the Holy Spirit to place His words in our mouths for not just the defense of the Gospel, but for the hearing and telling of the entire discussion, thus validating the worth of the thoughts and words of the person/people with whom are talking. If we discount the worth of the person or words spoken to us, we have no basis for expecting them to consider our words of any value either. Hence, we set the stage for an emotionally-based confrontive argument and not a love-based engaging discussion. Thank you Greg for your considered input and sound counsel.
A few more thoughts on the subject… In Acts 17, Paul addresses the philosophers gathered in the Aeropagus by way of referencing the statue of an unknown God. “Hey guys – I can tell you about this unknown God.” (He may have phrased this slightly differently than I offer.) He used this tactic as a way of opening a conversation from the standpoint of first finding common ground, then proceeded to move the conversation to higher ground. (I know – puns are the lowest form of humor.) We could call this ‘relationship based evangelism,’ for want of a better term. The point is, he didn’t polarize the conversation with initial statements debating truth claims, but first gained the right to be heard by deftly inserting himself into an ongoing conversation, and then offered increasingly effective information substantiating his rhetoric regarding the truth about a God unknown to the philosophers. His methodology, demeanor, and delivery were collectively effective enough to gain hiim another hearing. “Hey come back again and tell us more!” He did all of this in the center of their culture. So, what’s my point?
Well, consider the modern seeker-friendly movement (Willow Creek; Saddleback; etc.) We know the design: Make church friendly to the unchurched, then steadily move repeat attenders into small groups for discipleship. Get them plugged in as members. From there, help them discover their gifts, call, and service. From there, get them performing in ministry in some role. It’s a model that works well in making an appeal to the human need for significance, and has become so successful that we now see it worldwide in a plethora of denominational and non-denominational mega-church iterations. Okay, fine Greg, but what are you trying to say? Bill Hybels of Willow Creek (he currently embroiled in character scandals) stated several years ago that he felt they (Willow Creek) had ‘missed it.’ He was lamenting what he considered to be evident lack of true discipleship. (Yes, I know… big subject). BUT – HERE”S THE POINT: I believe the descent of the popular culture from WWII until now (you know all the statistics) has radically changed the culture of the church. When the mega-churches first really gained traction in the ’80’s, there was still a strong ‘earnest deposit’ of Christian culture in the broader popular culture. But as the popular culture continued(s) to become secularized and shame-disconnected (no relevant concept of sin), and as the seeker-church strove to make itself appealing to that culture, it permeated the church, and changed the church culture. The process that worked at first became corrupted by the progressive invasion of the descending popular culture into the church, and that worked its way in a multi-generational 40-year process from Sunday mornings all the way down into the small groups. The net effect of this, I believe, is that discipleship has become ‘doing by the numbers’ rather than ‘growing daily in the grace and knowledge of the Lord Jesus.’ It is really easy to appeal to the human need to do something significant; it is truly difficult to change human character through operant conditioning – once the external structure is removed, there is little to hold the human doer to theologically sound change (referencing Pastor Jim’s earlier comment, Rom. 12:2.) I am mindful of J’s word in Matt. 7: “Strive to enter in at the narrow gate, for wide is the gate and broad is the path that leads to destruction. Narrow is the gate and straight is the path that leads to eternal life, and few there are that find it.” Emphasis is on last phrase, and pardon me for quoting from memory. Conclusion: In times that look like the time of Noah (violence and perversion filled the earth – yes, apocalyptic eschatology here), shouldn’t the church be manifestly different than the surrounding culture? Paul’s answer was to preach Christ crucified; if we’re to offer hope to the few that might find it, we might best concentrate on being Christ-like in our own character. And, we should know our Bibles well, especially in the realm of salvation by grace through faith alone (in Jesus), and in sanctification by being models and practitioners of progressive spiritual formation. This isn’t legalism – it’s life-blood. Peter: “Where else would we go – you have the words of life.”
Well said.
Well said Don. I think it is interesting that the reference is to an image on a coin and the question being one of duty and ultimately submission to the representative government authority. Jesus coming to establish the Kingdom of God, has created the dilemma of where the believers ultimate loyalties belong. Staying under authority to questionable governments such that we pray for “all those in authority,” has to propel us out of the purely political realm into a realm marked by submission, first to God, to each other in the body of Christ, and then local and regional laws, reasonable or not. I understand being submitted to government here does not mean I do everything the government demands, but rather understand and respect that if I willfully break the law, I should just as willfully subject myself to the penalty proscribed by the law. Paul was imprisioned for preaching. He did not resist arrest. But, as soon as he was released with an admonition to not preach, he went right out and resumed preaching. So, as we approach these proving times in our own culture where just being an outspoken Christian will have legal repercussions, we should not resist arrest, but neither should we cease teaching and preaching the Kingdom until only death will put the final seal on our lips. Woe to the watchman that does not give a certain warning cry. If this sounds too radical now, it will only be what makes the Faithful effective when the culture really begins to war with the church. We will only overcome through our faith and the sure Word of our testimony. It won’t be just the coin that is rendered unto Caesar. For some, it will be our bodies.
Perhaps when the Church learns the full lesson of: “Render unto Caesar the things which are his and unto God the things which are His,” then we will also be able to confess that, “Never the twain shall meet.”
Greg, as we look at our culture as the topic under discussion, I was encouraged by your comment to look up Reinhold Niebuhr and examine his biography. In doing so, I discovered this very relevant quote: https://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/reinhold_niebuhr_159157.
“Our age knows nothing but reaction, and leaps from one extreme to the other.” I note that if one listens to the casual conversations on the street today, the subject matter is often about our President and there seems to be no “non-extreme” opinions held. As you might imagine, the vitriol expressed, even between/among believers is both animated by vehement, radical emotion, and impregnated with a spirit that does not reflect a peaceable character. I don’t think the content is the focus as a concern for the spiritual realms in which we live and move, but rather the “spirit” of the words coming glibly from the tongues’ freely wagging opinions that do not engender unity, but rather divide us one from another on issues that are wrongfully elevated to the level of scripture itself. That is to say, the church is divided on politics to the same extent that scriptural disagreements impact denominational justifications for remaining apart from each other. I see this as a great evil that is going unchecked in our church world. The Christian is not called to react to the extremes, but to keep a level head, discerning the place and value where words, time, and effort should be most expediently exercised in order to establish the Kingdom of God first in the church, and then out to the world. Like a grain of mustard seed, we are to be growing until we fill the whole earth under the authority of the one true “Government” over all. Does that mean I don’t care about who is President from election to election? No, it just means that hopefully I would not have been one of those who asked for a Saul to be made king over Israel, when God was enough to deliver and preserve Israel until they would one day look upon Him who they had pierced. My thinking is that God’s heart was pierced first when the people called for an earthly king instead of letting God be fully God in their midst. The piercing of Jesus on the cross went right to and through the heart of all that matters. When the church is divided along political lines, we are investing too much power in an earthly king.
Douglas, I deeply appreciate what the Lord has done in sending both Pastor Jim Kirkby and yourself to continue ‘fleshing out’ the Body of Christ in MBC, and note with great satisfaction how the impact of the dynamically growing culture of hope permeating the church faith community is beginning to bring change not only inside the walls, but demonstrably outside and touching the community of Mendocino. Bravo! (Uhh…, “Praise the LORD!”).
In response to the subject matter of this first blog, I add this: It’s really important to know what time it is. By that I mean, “What should the response of the church be to the surrounding culture?” Always evangelism, sure. But consider Reinhold Niebuhr, a theologian writing in the ’30’s prior to and during the run-up to WWII, who penned classic thoughts about, briefly, 5 potential relationships of church and culture, ranging from ‘Christ Against the Culture’ to ‘Christ in the Culture.’ Knowing what time it is means, essentially, to (like the men of Issachar) know the signs of the times – to have an informed world-view not only of the Christian culture, but also the surrounding culture, and using that information to intentionally engage with that culture. It sharpens our our exegesis of the scriptures in a way that makes our ministry of the Living Word become like “apples of gold in settings of silver.”
Yet another scripture comes to mind, Jim. “If any man be in Christ, he is a new creature….all things have become new, (newness of life) and old things have passed away.
Another verse which comes to mind is “Be not conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind.” If “living the truth” in the sense that Arthur Katz and Paul Volk put forth in their book is to be done, and it should be, then it will come about from the inside out, not by taking on the appearance of righteous behavior. Our behavior, reactions, and the “good” actions we initiate come from who we are. And the “who we are” is exactly what Christ came to change. The mark of a person who is a true believer is that he or she is actually walking in newness of life, and that will definitely be different from the ways of the world.
Thank you, Douglas, for the post.
It comes as no surprise to me that unbelievers are able to recognize differences and spot a phony.
The discouraging part is that many Christians seem to have lost this ability.
And it is this DIFFERENCE for which those being drawn to the Lord are seeking and hungering.
Unbelievers know when when their lives are not working and if they are living a sham. It genuineness which they seek.
If we kept God as first place in our lives at all times, our light would shine contrasted against the darkness of unbelief in the world. Unbelievers drawn to the Lord would be drawn to the light in Christians and we could share the good news of the Gospel with them.
And yet it seems to me that so many Christians have let other priorities root around their hearts take root like tentacles, so that they have little hunger for God, His Word, and His ways. As I heard one pastor say recently, “Christians have filled up with so many of the delicacies of the world around them (sports, movies, boating, fishing, excessive work – WHATEVER), that they have little or no hunger left for God.” They have eaten of everything else, and now they are full. They have no appetite left for Him – nor any time.
YES, we are to be different. I admire your church’s stance for loving the truth. Keep it up!
To me, perhaps the greatest importance of living a life of TRUTH, is that this DIFFERENCE points out that there IS a right and a wrong, a truth and an error. It points out this difference.
Satan would LOVE to extinguish this light, because without the contrasting light shining against the darkness and exposing the sinfulness of man, there is no longer any need for a Savior.
David
Thank you David. You are our first responder to our first blog, so let me be the first to say we appreciate your comment and acknowledge the value of your words to our readers. How can the church address some of these cultural issues that are entertained or practiced or sanctioned in the name of “love?”